Pandemic flu vaccine not linked to rare nerve disorder
July 28, 2011 at 6:47 pm
Pandemic flu vaccine not linked to rare nerve disorder
(AFP) – Jul 12, 2011
PARIS — Vaccines used in the 2009 “swine flu” pandemic caused no perceptible rise in a neurological disorder called Guillain-Barre syndrome, a study published in the British Medical Journal (BMJ) said on Wednesday.
The investigation is part of a safety probe into booster-aided flu vaccines that dates back 35 years.
In 1976, immunisation against a “swine flu” virus in the United States was halted after doctors found a seven-fold increase in risk from Guillain-Barre.
Studies on subsequent seasonal virus vaccinations found either no increases or only a modest increase in risk, leaving unresolved a debate whether the flu jab could be dangerous or not.
Guillain-Barre is a disease in which the body’s immune defences attacks nerve cells, causing muscle weakness and sometime paralysis. It is very rare, occurring in a range between 0.4 and four per 100,000 “person years,” a measure of risk used in epidemiology. It is fatal in three to 10 percent of cases.
The study, funded by the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control (ECDC) was done among 50 million people in five European countries where doctors had used a flu jab with a booster, also called an adjuvant, to prime the immune system.
The probe matched 104 cases of Guillain-Barre syndrome against people who were otherwise healthy.
They found no evidence of risk of Guillain-Barre syndrome from the vaccination.
However, they could not rule out a theoretical but still small increased risk, amounting to less than three excess cases of the syndrome for every million individuals protected by the vaccination.
“This study provides reassurance that adjuvanted pandemic influenza A(H1N1) 2009 vaccines did not increase the risk of Guillain-Barre syndrome substantially, if at all,” says the paper.
Swine flu killed at least 18,449 people and affected some 214 countries and territories after it was uncovered in Mexico and the United States in April 2009.
The UN’s World Health Organisation (WHO) declared a pandemic on June 11, 2009. The event was formally over on August 10, 2010.
Copyright © 2011 AFP. All rights reserved.
AnonymousJuly 31, 2011 at 4:31 pm
[SIZE=”3″][COLOR=”RoyalBlue”]CIDP I hate to disagree with you but I happen to know a father who yanked his daughter out of a top hospital because 5 neurologist had 5 different thoughts on what his daughter had. She had GBS.The course in med school is a elective when it comes to CIDP/GBS and I agree most doctors really do not care to be bothered with GBS. The people here know more about GBS and most doctors really don’t care to know[/COLOR][/SIZE]
August 1, 2011 at 8:23 am
[QUOTE=mochacat][SIZE=”3″][COLOR=”RoyalBlue”]CIDP I hate to disagree with you but I happen to know a father who yanked his daughter out of a top hospital because 5 neurologist had 5 different thoughts on what his daughter had. She had GBS.The course in med school is a elective when it comes to CIDP/GBS and I agree most doctors really do not care to be bothered with GBS. The people here know more about GBS and most doctors really don’t care to know[/COLOR][/SIZE][/QUOTE]
hey cat, hope yer feeling good today
I tend to agree with you to some extent, I too have been to my doctors and have felt that they have been clueless as to their medical advice regarding recovery….my physio/massage therapy team could teach them a lot……and you are right about some twit doctors, I was sent home from emerg [U]with[/U] a GBS diagnosis [I]and was told to come back if it got worse![/I]…..further look at the boneheads in Arizona who are dealing with an outbreak(!) of GBS and are advising people to wash their hands to avoid it, they dont know where to start….for now the folks who make IVIG have the GBS/CIDP market cornered and are making a tidy profit from it….when I was first diagnosed I would have argued against your points Cat, however I have learned a lot since, the incompetence of the medical field, the control the IVIG people have over research/treatment as well as the doctor ‘specialists’ who are on their payroll have corrupted the chances of finding any real solutions to this ‘syndrome’
AnonymousAugust 1, 2011 at 8:38 am
[COLOR=”DeepSkyBlue”][SIZE=”3″]GH-CIDP you stated that doctors were doing their best to find the answers to GBS/CIDP and I agree with the post about the doctors are morons and to add to that what northern guy said about the outbreak in Arizona—wash your hands–don’t drink the water–don’t drink XYZ BEER. You will catch GBS/CIDP. and these were educated DOCTORS(lol) what a joke.Doctors when it comes to GBS have a game called WHO IS THE BEST GUESSER.[/SIZE][/COLOR]
AnonymousAugust 3, 2011 at 8:51 am
[SIZE=”2″][COLOR=”Green”]My friend GH/CIDP. I retired from a top hospital and was around doctors all day long. I have seen doctors have a discussion on someone in the hall where every one can hear. I have heard doctors say give them to Dr so and so. This hospital I worked at had a doctor just walk away from a teen with GBS. Her dad has a law suit against them now.I was blessed as was sent to another hospital with the best around on GBS. I have had doctors say what is GBS. The doctors today are not the doctors of yesterday. Today all they care about is the money–and volumn of people. The new generation of doctors treat by a pill and guessing. Yes I have anger and millons more also. Did you read where all the samples given free to you that the doctors get gifts if they push that drug companys meds.Do you read the warning with your meds. 4 pages on how this med will slowley kill you and 1 line on how great it is. By the way in France GBS is called THE FRENCH POLO. I will say it again why do over 95% of the medical people refuse the flu shot ??????? HAVE A NICE DAY[/COLOR][/SIZE]
August 3, 2011 at 9:51 am
[QUOTE=GH-CIDP]Some people posting here seem to have a low opinion of the medical profession in the context of GBS or CIDP, but my experience leads me to the opposite conclusion. Both of my neurologists (the first left my medical group) are excellent. I have complete confidence in both of them, even when they have been uncertain of the diagnosis and the course of treatment because uncertainty is inherent in the condition. The same goes for my General Practitioner.
In the course of my illness, I must have encountered a few hundred people in various branches of the medical profession, and I can only think of a tiny number with whom I had some problem. That applies across the board to doctors, nurses, nurse assistants, technicians, therapists, pharmacists, and others.
I understand that sometimes someone might be treated by someone who seems not to know what they are doing, but I don’t understand how someone can complain that doctors don’t understand these neuropathies and at the same time disparage medical researchers who are trying to improve the medical profession’s understanding of them. Where’s the logic in that?
I detect anger in some of these posts, which is inappropriate for a condition which is nobody’s fault. Anger is not conducive to healing, in my opinion. I feel fortunate that the medical profession has made as much progress as it has with GBS and CIDP before I became ill. It was not so long ago that serious cases of GBS led to death from respiratory failure or other complications. Now deaths from GBS are rare for anyone with access to modern hospital care. Although I never had serious respiratory impairment, I could have died from pneumonia had I not had hospital care.
Even though I still have impairment, and do not know if I will ever recover from it completely, every day I feel good about the progress I have made in getting back on my feet. Often I encounter people who have had worse luck, who are in wheelchairs (as I was) but who will not get out of them, or who have had strokes which incapacitate them in worse ways.
Admittedly, it is easier to be positive when one is improving, however slowly. It is much more difficult when things are going downhill. Nevertheless, blaming the medical profession is not the answer. It is only through bona fide medical practitioners that GBS and CIDP can be treated effectively. Finding and working with those in who you can place your confidence is the path to recovery.
Final thought for the day: Happiness is within.[/QUOTE]
You’re damn right that I am bitter regarding the amount of incompetence I have encountered. I am still furious about being sent home from emerg and not being immediately hospitalized. Those couple of days going down further have resulted in longer residuals.
It’s good you feel you have had good care (though I doubt you met 300 med staff, this sounds like an exaggeration). However, you sound like an apologist, possibly even a mole to plant positive stories. Your arrogance is evident when you discount the rotten care many of the rest of us got simply because you did alright. How dare you say that I’m inappropriate in my response to MY care. Are you suggesting that I am incapable of judging what happened to me? Were you there?
Maybe you should keep your ‘know-it-all’ posts that tell us how we should be feeling to yourself.
AnonymousAugust 3, 2011 at 10:03 am
[SIZE=”3″][COLOR=”Green”]Northern Guy I stand beside you 100% He sounds like a doctor who plays the guessing game or is connect with a drug company. $13000 a bottle for IVIG or higher sure is not cheap. I feel sorry for the ones who do not have insurence. [/COLOR][/SIZE]
AnonymousAugust 3, 2011 at 10:25 am
I stand with Mochacat and NGG on this one. I got mild GBS [B]4 days [/B]after the H1N1 vaccine. Do not try to tell me that this was not caused by the vaccine!!! Several people came on here after the 2009 flu vaccines with GBS. I was perfectly fine beforehand. Now, I am a year and a half post. While the neuro issues have gotten better, I deal with chronic arthritic pain that this triggered and ongoing fatigue. I was a healthy functioning full time working mother of 2 kids under 3 when this happened, 38 years old.
I went to the ER and was sent home with a diagnosis of dehydration. Was later told I should have been admitted to the hospital. Went to 7 neuros, 4 at top hospitals in Chicago. Now on my second rheumy. Have been to countless other doctors for related issues. None of them really know what is going on, how to address this or how to treat this. We don’t know what is wrong with you??, they say. Your tests are normal. I have now gone to Miami to the CFS clinic down there, where they understand that vaccines can trigger all sorts of problems. Why did I have to travel from Chicago to Miami? Because of the incompetence of doctors and the lack of experience with this situation. 1 in a million gets a flu vaccine reaction, no wonder they don’t know what to do. No wonder we don’t hear about these people in the news. The doctors don’t know how to think outside the box, outside their specialty. They are taught to support vaccines. While I agree that vaccines save lives, and I continue to give my children vaccines with trepidation, I wish that I had known more about the dangers/risks of the flu vaccine.
Now I don’t know what your experience has been, GH-CIDP, but don’t be so quick to judge when you have not walked in other’s shoes. I lost 25 lbs from severe nausea and vomiting, had numbness and tingling everywhere, severe depression, anxiety, hair loss, etc. Need I go on. I have reclaimed my life to some degree, by taking supplements, starting on gluten free and dairy free diet, doing yoga, and I went to therapy for a year to deal with this. And not one doctor has really helped me except for the holistic ones and my therapist. A lot of money has been spent out of my pocket for this!! So yes, those of us who have been affected are angry, will always be angry, but we live our lives to the best of our abilities, try to accept it, try to have a positive attitude and move on. This forum is a place for people to express all kinds of opinions and we should be supportive of those who have different experiences than we do.
AnonymousAugust 3, 2011 at 4:40 pm
I dont know what you call anger but there has not been a sign of ANGER in any posts. Yes we have been stern with answers and open with feelings and about doctors. Have you ever walked in our shoes. We research and look behind the walls for information. Not the (BS) they want us to see. Did you hear SEA GULLS spread GBS??? NOT REALLY but this is to show just how stupid the report was from Arizona. And people without GBS/CIDP believe all this stuff.
Last year the flu and swine flu outbreak the way the CDC and news made it look the end of the world has arrived. My hospital threathen a walkout when they were told they had to have the shots.The only ones who want it is the ones making money from it.
The shot is useless this year against any new flu only last yrs flu. Did you catch flu last year ???? they say it will help to ease any flu you may get this year.(BULL)When you see a new doctor do you say do you know what GBS is and they are trained to say yes.Now put his rear on the floor say WHAT IS IT.
When I had my Bi-Pass my surgon had EVERYONE on his team know what GBS is. They even changed a drug to be extra safe. I and thousands of others who have suffered with GBS/CIDP are fed up with medical doctors lie and guess while playing a game of I AM A STUPID MED SCHOOL GRAD..I am not anger have not been anger as I posted only being open–honest and how I feel[/COLOR][/SIZE]
AnonymousAugust 4, 2011 at 12:33 pm
Remember the big court case of the tobacco companies vs the tobacco-related illnesses. The tobacco companies had all those ‘doctors’ to testify that tobacco wasn’t injurious to anyone’s health. And they even lied in court.
And the thalidamyde deformities, breast-implant cancers, UID cancers, HRT cancers, and how many other medical research/consumer product horror stories.
I don’t believe the GBS rate is 1 in a million. I have since located 3 people within a radius of 30 miles who got it in 2007, in a population of 100,000. As well, there is a now a small GBS group starting up in my area to collect all the cases of years past and since. The medical personnel cover up the truth, even distort it, walk out on us, shove us onto other doctors. They did this to us, but they can’t fix us. Meanwhile, the profits from vaccines and medical treatments, etc. keep rolling in to feed the system as it is.
Sometimes, we patients are in the hands of fools and devils.
God help us!
My last visit to a doc a few months ago: this doc was new; I was seeing him for sudden edema with extremely swollen hands and feet. He immediately said the reason I was using a medical walker was because I was overweight, and he was going to discontinue my asthma steroids because he thought they might be causing my weight gain (though sudden withdrawal from my asthma meds would have killed me, as well as the asthma). He wouldn’t review my file, though it was same clinic, but was more interested in me proving to him that I hadn’t caused my own edema by an unhealthy lifestyle. The time in the office was spent in me proving to him that I am a non-smoker, non-drinker, live & walk a mile from the office, had no vehicle, used 2 flights of stairs in my home daily, but rode a bike and was athletic up until my flu shot in 2007, got GBS from the flu shot (he said there was no info regarding GBS in my medical records, though the last 3 doctors have freely discussed & admitted the diagnosis for a couple of years now). He tightened the blood pressure cuff on my swollen arm till I screamed and screamed in pain, nearly passing out, but wouldn’t release it for quite a while after it registered.
The whole visit was a nightmare from hell, but at least I got my asthma meds renewed, so I won’t die of asthma.
My own case is worsening now; the pain is terrible, and I’m losing ground, but I make the best of each day, as well as I can. We shouldn’t have to come on this site, and deal with other posters who chastise us in our damaged condition. Shame on them.
AnonymousAugust 4, 2011 at 1:15 pm
Their report is flawed; the truth is what counts, and obviously they don’t have that.
In this forum alone, several people who post regularly got GBS from the 2007 flu vaccine. We are all in North America; and there are many, many more cases which are not represented on this forum, many which are undiagnosed, misdiagnosed, covered-up, don’t even go on medical records because they fall through the cracks.
It used to be that the statistics stated that 3 % of GBS patients die, then the figure went up to 6 %, and now it has changed to 10 %. So there are numerous discrepancies, yet these statistics come from medical records.
It’s getting harder and harder to do the math, especially when the real facts are lost in the process.
AnonymousAugust 4, 2011 at 6:46 pm
Hmm, that’s funny, 2 of my doctors said it was 1 in a million, and they think they’re experts. :rolleyes:
My my, how this whole issue gets twisted around and clouded with words, and more words. Just a jumble of contention, instead of the application of truth.
edited to add info.
AnonymousAugust 5, 2011 at 11:41 am
The truth is out there, but it’s certainly not out there in those so-called ‘studies’.
The Health Department should take out ads in every local newspaper in Canada, and ask people with GBS & CIDP to come forward with their case, and actually deal with them properly concerning diagnosis and treatment, and then they’d have the real facts for their ‘statistics’.
Incidentally, when I was researching the Canadian Medical Association’s statistics on GBS online a couple of years ago, I found out that info was privileged for medical personnel only, and not even available to the public.
Why the secrecy?
And after all those errors administering the H1N1 vaccine in Canada, our Health Minister had only this to say when people exhibited an adverse reaction…’Hospitalized, and no permanent damage’. How would he know, since it takes weeks & months to assure a diagnosis? Where are those people now?
AnonymousAugust 5, 2011 at 3:53 pm
It sounds like you guys are looking for someone to blame for either not being diagnosed quickly or perhaps mis-diagnosed …. I understand the anger behind the disease but to blame all doctors and drug companies is foolish .
Doctor’s diagnose through a process of ruling out . They can not look at you and say ” Oh yes it’s GBS “. They can only go by what you are presenting with and go from there . I too was sent home and told I had a pinched nerve and after my 4th visit to the ER they finally were able to figure it out .
Doctor’s go to school for a long time and they are not always trained in every disease or condition out there …
Also doctors DO NOT get kickbacks from drug companies . When you get samples at your PCP office it is from the drug companies for patients to try to see if the medication works for them . It is also provided for patients who can not afford their medications …they come in for the samples so they can take their medications properly .
You seem so misguided on these issues and obviously something is wrong for you to think this way . I would think that if I didn’t really know the answers I would be better off asking my doctor these questions than to assume the worst . If your doctor is not comfortable answering them …then time for a new doctor !!
August 5, 2011 at 5:26 pm
beach and gh, you obviously didn’t read my post where I mention being sent home from emerg [U]with[/U] a GBS diagnoses. my father came up with more info on his i-phone than the doctor could offer. when I was admitted, the attending doctor was incredulous at this. he said that should have never happen. I could add more about the horror show that was my care after that. Many others here report they had similar poor care. as well, my doctors have been little good othet than having the authority to sign forms…..my therapy team know FAR more about repairing and promoting the healing of damaged nerves
please do not sound like ****** by saying we are somehow deluded
I could give a s*** about my shoddy care however, I agree it isn’t going to do much to be p***ed off. however, is the next patient going to go through the same bs? is someone else going to be left to further go down because of incompetence?
and no docs dont get kickbacks for prescriptions, but the ones defending the drug company research certainly do
August 5, 2011 at 7:09 pm
[quote=GH-CIDP]NGG, I’m sorry you had a bad experience with a doctor, but I don’t know why you think it has something to do with me. I wouldn’t recommend anyone stay with a doctor in whom they lack confidence. Find one you like better.
As for whether I read your post or not, I tend not to read the posts of angry persons, and when I do read an angry post, I generally ignore it. Anger is not conducive to healing, as I’ve said before.[/quote] you don’t get many choices after waiting 9 hrs in emerg, you get what you get at that point and the clock is ticking….while your nerves are being destroyed by the hour….What do you suggest I should have done at that point? supposedly, according to the docs you have faith in, I should have been mainlining IVIG ASAP, however I got ‘quacks’ as you like to call them
AnonymousAugust 5, 2011 at 8:40 pm
[SIZE=”4″][COLOR=”SeaGreen”]Hello Ms Kimberley. I hate to pop your bubble but the samples left the doctors are usually a new drug and the more a doctor gives out the better his trip. Like 10 days in Hawai for him and family. Your dream about the drug samples being for the poor. Get serious most doctors won’t allow you in their office if you are not a patient. You are what doctors love (OH YES DOCTOR–YES THIS AND YES THAT.) Have you ever seen a nurse clean an exam room before you come in. My vets exam rooms are cleaner.Because the name had a DR beside it mean they know what they are doing. Ask your great doctors if they took a flu shot and see how many will lie. I trust any report from Canada or France as much as swimming with 20 GREAT WHITE SHARKS[/COLOR][/SIZE]
AnonymousAugust 5, 2011 at 9:47 pm
Hear, hear…mochacat & NGG. 🙂
I’ll never forget the time my old doc was pushing Vioxx samples on me at the same time I was undergoing months of testing and treatment for a serious heart condition. Good thing I read the info sheet. In big, bold print: Has been known to cause heart attack and stroke; do not take if you have heart trouble, high blood pressure, thyroid trouble, asthma, etc. I have all those conditions, so took the samples back to doc, and said I wasn’t going to take them. He grabbed them, tossed them back up on into the cabinet and said, I’ll just give them to someone else.
A few months later, Vioxx was in the media news for causing deaths; I think it was recalled or discontinued at that point.
Live long enough, and you’ll have lots of these kinds of experiences with our great god doctors.
So in this particular issue of the H1N1 studies, let’s take the ‘studies’ with some common sense. In other words, they don’t really represent the facts, since the medical profession is the first to cover its mistakes, and in Canada, we don’t even have practical recourse to deal with mistakes or malpractise unless the patient is a extremely wealthy, persistent and well-represented by legal counsel, with multiple proofs.
I believe it is a very good thing to voice one’s feelings, opinions and experiences in a serious matter like this, and not to bury them inside, or be silent. There is strength in numbers, and as with any other cause, it is the silence of the victims that keeps the problems from being dealt with. It is good to be honest with oneself, speak the truth and get it out there so others can benefit from it. And since this forum is set up to be a support to those afflicted with GBS-CIDP, the major requirement as per the rules is that we share this information in an atmosphere of mutual respect. And although I certainly don’t agree with some of the posters here who seem to be overly defensive of the medical profession to the detriment of the patients, I can only conclude by saying that ‘methinks they protest too much’, and I can’t really understand why.
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