Has it been ten years?
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March 5, 2007 at 4:09 pm
Yes, it has been ten years since my initial bout with GBS. Wow, such a milestone hits hard for me. It compels me to contemplate the years , and how GBS sent my life in a different direction. I am not one to say if I am living for the better or worse as a result. Life is a mixed bag of tricks, and I try to dwell upon the positive aspects. Yet, this is a difficult proposition for me in that a post-GBS residual gift included a wonderful case of dysthymic depression. A friend described me once as “a depressed fellow who is tired all of the time, yet seems to keep a brilliant sense of humor about him”. Hey, that sounds like Rodney Dangerfield to me!
At times, I wonder what my life would be like if I had not one the GBS lottery a decade ago. I am sure many of you fellow members of the GBS fan club appreciate how easy it is to get caught up in the “what if” syndrome, but I realize when it comes to health, life and death, the standards of our living, it really is a crap shoot. I mean, while I lay close to death in a hospital bed I could have been quite healthily killed by some freak accident. Could it be that GBS saved my life? My conflated mind wants to think so, as a form of justification, to tolerate the myriad of inconveniences I have had to contend with over the years.
In retrospect, I do see trends in my life I am not happy about, this post-GBS life of mine. My guess is that most who come into contact with a GBS incident do fully recover. Such is not my case in that even though I look functional if ever you met me in person, I have residuals that keep on giving. Others are hurting a lot more than me around here, for sure, and there are so many of you far worse off than my state I feel embarrassed posting this diatribe here. Then again, I m not sure who else to share my story with, those of you who can relate to me at least to some degree.
It seem as I grow older- I am forty-eight- the on-going fatigue takes on greater prominence in my consciousness. I mean, I feel preoccupied with the sense of feeling tired all of the time. I have felt this way for ten years now. Yes, a consistent sense of pressure or weight that has been with me all along, this chronic fatigue. I recall about three years into recovery, I wondered why I continued to feel exhausted since the information given to me at the hospital said “full recovery”, not partial recovery or “you will be able to function but you will feel like there are fifty pounds of rocks on you back for the rest of your life”. (Strange, but as I wrote the preceding line I felt ripped-off by the hospital that saved my life!) I feel angry that my story did not end with the happy result I desired and even anticipated. I feel afraid and concerned for my future in that age and fatigue are not friends.
This ties into the notion I feel powerless to impact my sense of fatigue. I find it difficult to manage my energy levels with any sense of confidence and feel this aspect of my self is beyond my control. One might suggest that since I have no control over my fatigue I might best turn the whole matter over to my higher power, but the reality is I have not adapted to my circumstance well. I went from a high earning sales person to a rolling stone of an employee, moving from one sales job to another trying to find a place where I could make a living as a fatigued, depressed sales person. The funny thing is I am still a pretty good sales person, but the days of traveling and earning big bucks continues to elude me. My experience taught me how much my pre-GBS high energy and drive plays a factor in a sales career. LOL Think I need a career change? What career would better suit a depressed and fatigued individual who can work only about 40 hours a week and uses a high amount of sick days?
One might say my best laid plan for the future is to hook up with a rich woman who likes to laugh. If only she would knock on my front door soon. I want to go out and meet her, but I just don’t feel like going out right now. I am tired and want to try and sleep. Am I going to feel tired and like not going out for the rest of my life? I don’t get no respect ! Well, a good thing I enjoy online gaming 🙂 I will keep you all posted!
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March 5, 2007 at 6:08 pm
Rocker,
What eloquence! Honestly, you have put into words many feelings I cant express.
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I recall about three years into recovery, I wondered why I continued to feel exhausted since the information given to me at the hospital said “full recovery”, not partial recovery or “you will be able to function but you will feel like there are fifty pounds of rocks on you back for the rest of your life”.
[/QUOTE]Thats how I felt for 18 years, until I found this site, now I understand that ‘full recovery’ is just not my GBS experience. I’m 40, besides my body that feels like 94 many days, I really dont feel older than I did at 25, only wiser ….:D
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March 5, 2007 at 6:50 pm
Rocker, I echo Ali’s comment. You really said it! Your words were what I have been unable to voice or write or explain to family and friends. You definitely belong here. I’m guessing you will hear many “thank-you”s for putting down what we all so often feel.
When they told me in the hospital almost 3 years ago that “you should make a full recovery” I was niave enough to believe them. I guess at the time I wanted to hear that. But the problem is that friends and family hear that also and it’s now so hard to help them understand that “full recoverys” are rare.
As for the new career you are looking for, I’d suggest writing or journalism. Rocker, you have a gift with words. Plus, you don’t have to be standing or running around expanding energy when you sit and write.
Start here, do it more often, and try your style out on us.
I’d love to hear more…
JayDee -
March 6, 2007 at 7:56 am
i agree with jay dee. your writing skills are remarkable. you’ve just summed up in one post, what we all feel post gbs. i’m going on six years and had to go on disability. went from a 50,000 a year job to disability, and i’m not entitled to medicare or any other benefit because i have a working spouse. you have a wonderful sense of humor and your writing gets right to the point. maybe journalism isn’t such a bad career move. good luck in whatever you decide to do, and keep writing to us and if anything, you’ll feel better knowing you’re not alone.
deb -
March 6, 2007 at 1:17 pm
Hi Rocker, nice to see you again. you do have a knack for journalism-i think you have already found your career path. Hey, if Fred Gwynn(Herman Munster) can write kids books-so can you! you obviously have a great sense of humor and don’t take yourself too seriously, why not give it a try!
from one humor loving, always laughing, fatigued person to another-don’t show your humor to a dr! they will always slap the psych dx on your forehead, mine did and still does!
May there always be laughter in your life, and a joke in your mind! take care.:D -
March 6, 2007 at 3:10 pm
Thanks for the supportive comments. I wish I could make a living writing. I also wish I could earn a living as a porno star, which is about as likely as someone paying me to write.
/me wonders if any of the wonderful woman who posted above are rich :p
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March 6, 2007 at 5:25 pm
My 5 year anniversary is coming up next week & I have been thinking many of the same thoughts as you have. But even as an ex-English teacher, I could not have written them down as well as you have; I agree with the others, you write eloquently. I think often about, “What might have been,” how different the lives of my husband & myself would have been had I not gotten sick. I am left with more residuals than you, must wear AFOs to walk, use a cane sometimes for balance, & need a lot of rest for the fatigue. Lost my teaching job just a few weeks after I became so ill, what a waste so much of all of this has been. Most people who see me out in public think I look great, little do they know the effort it takes for me to even walk!
But your post starting me thinking, what about having a dating service here on this sight? I would love to have a 48 year old man around who needed lots & lots of rest! Then I wouldn’t have to push myself to keep up with someone with normal energy all of the time. Someone who really understands what this fatigue feels like. I am not rich, but don’t really have to worry about money too much, but fortunately (or unfortunately) I do have a wonderful husband. But many here do not, & would welcome someone to live with who could live the way we have to now live. Interesting…
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March 6, 2007 at 5:38 pm
Rocker,
Oh my, do we have bunches in common. I am 10 years last month AND I am a single white female, 49 years young, that is dateless because I only have from 6pm to 8pm open two days a week. I wish you could have been with me today when I went to a new neuros office trying to explain exactly what you have written. I am just now getting a little close to what I was making 10 years ago and am in a job where I am over-qualified and that is the only thing that saves my butt from getting fired. Darn, I can’t write as eliquent as you…
Wanna date??? Oops, you are in Ohio? Hmmmm… can we meet half way? Oh, big oops, I am not rich but I do love to laugh (when I’m not too tired).
Hang in there – we are not alone (in more ways than one 😮 are you a Sci-Fi fan by chance?).
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March 6, 2007 at 6:37 pm
Chrissy …
Sorry to go off subjetct….. but, NEW JOB? Did I miss something? (besides the obvious of not speaking to you for ages 😮 )
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March 6, 2007 at 6:41 pm
Hi Rocker
Do you not get any help with the depression?
You mentioned that “the on-going fatigue takes on greater prominence in my consciousness”.
Do you mean that the fatigue itself has not worsened physically but that mentally you are more aware of it and the possibility of it interfering more in your life as you grow older?
I am only mildly affected so doubtless my attitude is different to some others. With the exception of when fatigue hit me whilst at work, it ordinarily hits when I am at home. I get little choice in the matter and hit the couch. So far, so long as my daughter is alright, nothing else has mattered to me what else was on the agenda becomes – nothing else is on the agenda.
What surprised me is that you said you can ‘only’ work 40 hours a week. I doubt very much that I could work 40 hours a week in employment, and I don’t particularly want to. 40 hours a week is a full working week, anything else is overtime.
God bless
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March 6, 2007 at 11:44 pm
Theresa,
I think what Rocker means is that here in the US most people are hired for a 40 work week. But that doesn’t really mean that they will only be expected to work 40 hours, especially if they want to advance in their chosen careers. All 3 of my children supposedly work 40 hours, but since they are salaried, instead of hourly, they are really expected to work until the work is done.Just one example, my middle child was hired as an IT Specialist to keep 11 clinics & 2 hospices “online” & install new software here in northern MN. But since he is usually in our large local clinic all day, most of the doctors & nurses page him every time they don’t understand something, their computer isn’t functioning right, or even if their printer isn’t working. They know they are supposed to call the help desk in Duluth, but also know that Dan is usually right there in the building. Anyways, he ends up putting in a lot more than 40 hours, with no overtime.
Rocker, I know it can’t be easy for you to work 40 hours a week, but I give you all the credit in the world. And then to try to have the energy to date as well? Many healthy people at age 48 would be too tired to date after working all day. You already have one taker right here on the forum, is Ohio really that far from Oklahoma? Sorry, but US geography was always my worst subject! I really do think it would be nice to live with someone who understood my fatigue, but then who would do all of the shoveling around here, the grocery shopping, & all of the other things I have no energy for?
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March 7, 2007 at 12:23 am
GBS bit me when I was 49 years old. The resulting PE almost killed me. I walk and drive and look normal. I am 56 now. I can relate to the comments on GBS fatigue. What I hate the most is the leg cramps, tingley face and dizzyness. It would be best if neuro docs did not give GBS’rs false hope but we are rare and the only patients they have that get better. I am not bitter. There are thousands of people much more severly injured than me in car wrecks every week. Be happy!
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March 7, 2007 at 1:37 pm
Pam,
I just found out it is about 856 miles from where I live and where Rocker lives. Oh well… you have a good point about who would get stuff done.
Let’s all be happy to be alive and able to read/type on this forum!
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March 8, 2007 at 11:40 pm
Whats makes me mad is stuff like the GBS international literature says that most make a full recovery. Why do they say stuff like that ? Most I have met do not make a full recovery and can never return to work and have to turn to disabiity like I had too. I came to this site several years ago, different structure forum then, and did not post as I felt bad as being in the minority of the “FEW” who don’t make a full recovery. Well, since then I have found out that most don’t make a full recovery and return to their jobs. I can’t believe they are still saying that on the GBS literature that is sent out to people. I had a nuero. tell me a few years back that you don’t have pain with GBS and here I was setting in front of him and was in so much pain i could hardly stand it. I too went from making big bucks to a small disability check once a month. So much for building my 401 K up. 🙁 I get so mad at DRS that I could choke them.
Rocker, I was in the hospital in Columbus, OH. for 4 months and almost died. Why don’t everyone say the same thing and that is that the majority do not make a complete recovery and return to their regular job…Phooy !
Rocker, I live about 150 miles from you and am married and even if I wasn’t married I would not ever date a man. lol 🙂 Gotta have some humor left anyway. 🙂 Later all……. -
March 8, 2007 at 11:44 pm
LOL. Such varying comments here.
Do you mean that the fatigue itself has not worsened physically but that mentally you are more aware of it and the possibility of it interfering more in your life as you grow older?
Teresa Anne, I mean that ten years down the road, ten years older, I feel the stresses of age comparable to a funky white guy approaching fifty, yet when I get the flu or do pass over my physical limitations, it seems to take longer for me to recover. I feel about as fatigued as alwasy most of the time, yet my batteries are not recharging as well, and the warranty expired. I recall five years ago my Neurologist reminded me that age frequently causes fatigue in and of itself. Look, I am no longer a spring chicken, or spring rooster, as it were! I had the Flu around Christmas and it was a tough ride… lasted for weeks, called in sick lots and I was somewhat concerned of a relapse, but I got better 🙂
As for depression, I am thrilled that I do not have a major depressive disorder and not so thrilled about these overtones of dysthimia. It all began when Father taught me how to swim. He threw me into the ocean at Jones Beach NY and, while laughing, said “Swim, Son, Swim”. Fortunately, I got out of the burlap bag. Ever since then it has been down hill. Need I tell you how when I was born Mother said, “What a treasure” and Father said “Let’s burry him in the back yard with the gold”? GBS, smeebs, I say. If anything, I am a much better blues bass player for it. Depressed? What the hell do I have to be depressed about when so many others are far off than me? I am alive today! Yes, born under a bad sign, been down for ten years now, but I am not done with life yet, not by a long shot!
I begin to think that I may have had a personality reorganization during my recovery. I am no way near as extroverted and tend to keep to myself. Certainly, my confidence and self worth are at an all time low, this slow spiral of mine. Nope, you will not see me dancing in a male review anytime soon…those days are over.. just cannot do it…don’t even ask. I have a mild case of depression IE no suicidal or homicidal ideation, thank goodness; however, I have mixed feelings about terrorists ;). I do take Effixor, and it is e-fixxin me, for the past year or so. I am in between insurance once again and cannot afford the hundred plus bucks a month, so I will probably wane myself off of the stuff soon. I might add a side effect is that I don’t get all that excited about much of anything. Hey, isn’t that a sign of depression? LOL I mean, the highs are not all that high and the lows are not as low, although I do feel down of late because I had to cash in me last egg, the last of my 401Ks I put away Pre-GBS.
So, it seems a sense of despair has cast its shadow over my downtrodden doorstep, with the notion that my house may soon go the way of the nest egg, or in a more general sense that I may not be able to care for myself as I get older..say forty-nine. Ahhhh, ever to loom of late, like the blowing grey winter clouds, my vitalities swept aside by fate, I drift without anchor toward unfriendly shores. Woe is me. Can a rich lady save me? Could someone set up the great Rocker Foundation and put aside a fortune so I can play my Bass and write posts on this Forum? It would also help if she were a brilliant psychotherapist.
On a brighter note, I start yet another new job on Monday!
/me composes new Country tune, “856 miles to see Chrissy”
It will take 856 miles to see Chrissy,
but my horse is about worn out.
I will need 856 miles to see Chrissy,
but all of my gasoline has… run out of the spout.Now, I’m not a cowboy living in Ohio,
I am Post-GBSer just moving down the line.
Now, I’m not just a Sci-Fi junky,
Arthur Clark’s Childhoods’ End sure is mighty fine.
But POST GBS has me stressed, so I don’t think I can make it a mile.LEAD SOLO
CHRISSY DANCES
BASS SOLO
CHRISSY AND ROCKER TAKE A BRIEF NAP
CHORUS…
IF I HAD ENOUGH ENERGY TO GET A MILE, THE OTHER 855 WILL GO FINE BY ME….PERHAPS WE SHALL MEET IN CHICAGO, WHO KNOWS, PERHAPS IN ALBUQUERQUE ….YEAH, YEAH ,YEAH,MORE STUFF
END
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March 9, 2007 at 8:58 am
Hi Rocker: I am two years out and will be 61 next month. I too get afraid of the future at times, especially as the pain in my legs gets worse not better. I lost a great deal too, having to semi-retire and cut my income by 60%. You made me think a lot about before and after and how I too was told I would have a lousy few months and then be just fine. What a shock to learn otherwise. But there is much I love about my new life. I have developed hobbys that do not require much energy-love to monitor airplane traffic on a scanner radio, read (fantasy and sci fi), and fly a simulated airplane. I have much time to meditate and play with my dreams-not to mention dreaming much more since I sleep so much more. I had to work through much guilt and some depression to get to loving life again, but somehow managed. I am not offering a prescription for you just sharing my own experience.
Before I got sick I was a writer-wrote four books and many articles on psychology and mysticism. I think I am a pretty good writer and recognize good writing and agree with others that your writing is excellant. It is hard to make a living at it and, despite what it might seem writing, takes as much energy as any job-maybe more. But I hope you play with the idea of writing even for fun as you do have talent and a great sense of humor. I have enjoyed all your posts and wish you luck with your new job. Jeff -
May 1, 2007 at 7:28 pm
My, I need to visit this forum more often. Thanks for such encouragement, Jeff. You remind me that I need to work on my attitude, which is not at all uplifting. I still have the blues, but I geel fetter after I play my bass. Perhaps the same might be true with writing?
I recently kicked out a few ideas on this here techno-parchment, would appreciate some feedback on what I have to date, if you would be so kind? I can e-mail it to you and you could have at it, perhaps even ghost write the whole thing over for me? LOL 🙂 Then, after the draft and many years hard work I could post it here!
/me sets completion of story date: 2020
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May 2, 2007 at 9:23 am
lay it on me Rocker! (man that just doesn’t sound right!:eek: 😀 ) my email is my user name ^ at yahoo dot com.
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May 2, 2007 at 1:24 pm
[QUOTE=Rocker]/me composes new Country tune, “856 miles to see Chrissy”
It will take 856 miles to see Chrissy,
but my horse is about worn out.
I will need 856 miles to see Chrissy,
but all of my gasoline has… run out of the spout.Now, I’m not a cowboy living in Ohio,
I am Post-GBSer just moving down the line.
Now, I’m not just a Sci-Fi junky,
Arthur Clark’s Childhoods’ End sure is mighty fine.
But POST GBS has me stressed, so I don’t think I can make it a mile.LEAD SOLO
CHRISSY DANCES
BASS SOLO
CHRISSY AND ROCKER TAKE A BRIEF NAP
CHORUS…
IF I HAD ENOUGH ENERGY TO GET A MILE, THE OTHER 855 WILL GO FINE BY ME….PERHAPS WE SHALL MEET IN CHICAGO, WHO KNOWS, PERHAPS IN ALBUQUERQUE ….YEAH, YEAH ,YEAH,MORE STUFF
END[/QUOTE]
Rocker, How did I ever miss this post??? Perhaps this is what happened the last time I tried to date – missed the whole date 😮 Oh, and I don’t know about the dancing part – maybe chair dancing :confused:
Anyway, I just love this!!! Thanks so much :p
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May 4, 2007 at 2:19 pm
At last, someone just speaking it to the point!!!!. Like I said before “Full Recovery” B.S., I will repeat myself again and say that I really believe we should not say we HAD GBS, but HAVE GBS, because the residuals will alwyas haunt us……. or should I say most of us. These docs are full of it….. I only wish they could walk in our shoes. Boy I bet they would change their tune about this thing called “FULL RECOVERY” xoxoxooxoxo Roxie
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May 4, 2007 at 6:52 pm
Chrissy, glad you liked my song!
/Roxie has moxy!
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May 4, 2007 at 10:02 pm
Since this appears to be a full service site, maybe we should have a night where singles can get together. It would certainly be people who have a lot in common and understand each other. My MAtch.com ran out the month I got GBS and they automatically renewed it. You should have read the e-mail I sent them describing my condition in detail! They cancelled it..and they are not known for doing this. I joined a few years ago because I felt that you need to open doors for the Universe to answer your requests. My heading was:
Blue-eyed blonde with Native Heart seeks long-haired Native American to embrace the magic under the stars and to walk the sacred path together.
Medicine woman desires Spiritual Warrior.I did it for a hoot, but got lots of replies…so many that I decided to meet at a beach bar in Tampa and scheduled them for every half hour. That didn’t work out….they didn’t want to leave. But if we had one thread where singles could post their interests, someone might make a connection or at least a good friend or phone pal. A lot of us have lost our friends from GBS.
As for doctors saying GBSers make a full recovery, I learned years ago not to believe them. That is why I went wholistic – not to be confused with ballistic!
When a doc said I had picked up fleas when I returned from backpacking through Europe…and it was actually SHINGLES…I gave up hope. The doc must have thought these so-called fleas were smart enough to come back each day and bite me in a pattern (hives). He even gave me a prsecription for flea powder!!!Dr. Phil said that if you marry for money, you wind up earning every penny of it. We are all rich in ways other than money.
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May 5, 2007 at 9:18 pm
You guys make this forum worthwhile…lol. I agree no one understands what we go thru. I started dating a guy about 18 months post gbs, so naturally he has no idea what I have been thru. And honestly I don’t think he understands why I am on disability and why I can’t go out on the dance floor and dirty dance with him and grind all up and down..not that I would anyway but I’m 43 years old and sometimes I feel and act like I am 90..not by choice of course.
So if any of you can hook up or find phone pals I say go for it because I don’t think anyone really understands unless they have been there or been thru it with someone else…Save a dance for me..Stormy
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May 6, 2007 at 9:15 pm
I’m still recovering from GBS & working-out 5 days a week now – regular physical exercise has helped me the most, I hardly ever feel fatique now.
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May 6, 2007 at 11:20 pm
wmoore,
Which neuro did you/do you see? A friend of mines drives up to Birmingham every few months to see his neuro at UAB, and really isnt very happy with him.
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May 8, 2007 at 5:14 pm
[QUOTE=wmoore]I’m still recovering from GBS & working-out 5 days a week now – regular physical exercise has helped me the most, I hardly ever feel fatique now.[/QUOTE]
me too, 15 months to be exact, exercise is what keeps me going…
I had a severe case and I am doing 20 minutes in a stationary bike and 1 hour of machines and dead weights 5 times a week, I do feel fatigue but I try not to give it a minute of my time, i feel I lost too much time already…live is too short to fall deep into depression, it is easier to feel sorry for ourselves but when you accomplish things like going out late, party, dance (even with a cane) you feel new…even little things anything helps..
now I even trailer my boat, and go out fishing all day come back wash it and store it… then I crash at home with the biggest smile …
believe me, I’m in pain, I walk with my cane and I refuse to minimize my existence to a couch potato just because of GBS, like others said.. there are worst things in life, we have a second chance!
do I feel sad?.. yes from time to time..
do I feel pain?… nonstop
is it difficult to walk? you bet!am I going to let that destroy my life? HELL NO!
as a suggestion please watch Little People Big World, they ARE really disable and they are an inspiration … to me..
Simon.
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May 8, 2007 at 5:32 pm
You know, I was fine as my body recovered- the real depression started after my third year, when I realized I was not going to fully recover. Simon, having depression is not a conscious choice- using mental will powers to rid one of depression is as successful as using a positive attitude to get rid of diarrhea! However, most certainly, it is a great idea to keep a positive attitude despite depression and to work a strong recovery plan.
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May 8, 2007 at 7:27 pm
We all have different ways to cope and recover. If I kept going despite my fatigue and pain it would only get worse. When the fatigue really hits me I have no choice but to lie down. My mind goes blank and my body can hardly move, so rest alone restores me. As for the pain, I tried my exercise bike and it aggravated things so much I could hardly walk for two weeks. We all have different degrees of nerve damage and that makes a big difference. I try to exercise every day by walking but ignoring my symptoms does not work. Taking care of my self is not giving up on life-it is living life my way and the best way I know. Jeff
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June 11, 2007 at 4:51 pm
I’m sorry, it’s been a long time.. I’ve been really busy
My intentions are not to insult anyone but the contrary…
We can all beat anything if we put our minds and bodies to it, exercice by itself is not enough, it should be done with strengh training (like pilates), a good knowledgable therapist and a balance nutrition, you’ll be amazed how much energy you can generate from the right balance nutrition, if you need medicines for depression then take them with a combination of psiquiatric/psicological help whatever helps but my point is that comming here feeling sorry for ourselves and in MY HUMBLE OPINION entering in a competition on who’s more sick than the other is not healthy… we should do the opposite! help each other to bounce back and gain a normal life and enjoy it…
I applaud the beautiful souls that help day in day out in this forum, it is not easy to go through the stuff we all went through…
I hope we can all find support to better our life with GBS…
Simon.
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June 12, 2007 at 8:36 pm
Rocker- I see this is not a new thread but am so glad I found it. Your writing is incredible. It’s like you can see inside what many of us go through in our heads. That you are able to express it so eloquently is truly a gift.
I had GBS about 2o years ago and it’s only been in the last few years that the “mild” residuals have become much more pronounced….actually almost profound. I posted elsewhere that my doc has thrown around the “fibromyalgia” diagnosis which I think is a bunch of crap. He completely dismissed the idea that my pain and fatigue could have anything to do with GBS. I know he’s wrong and am still working the system to get some help. I’ll have to look up what “dysthymic depression” is as I’ve been diagnosed MDD.
Anyway, thanks again for your amazing writing. Please do more of it here!!
p.s. How is the new job going?
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August 25, 2007 at 12:51 am
Hi Sylvia!
I wondered why this post was only six pages deep. LOL Glad you enjoy my writing, and feel strangely happy other victims of GBS can relate!
/me dances away from this thread once again.
/me takes nap after dancing a while
/me wonders if this thread will ever make it back to Forum page 201:eek: -
September 4, 2007 at 10:30 pm
Very well put Rocker… are we there yet? :rolleyes:
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